Recording on the T4 - EQ settings and the Master Compressor

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Recording on the T4 - EQ settings and the Master Compressor

Postby Hugh-AR » 27 Feb 2020 21:55

Better Digital Recording on the Tyros 4

Details about EQ settings and the Master Compressor and why they should be used.

It's all about the music ♫ ♪ ♫ Organ: Yamaha AR80 & Keyboard: Tyros 4
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Re: Recording on the T4 - EQ settings and the Master Compre

Postby dentyr » 01 Mar 2020 20:46

Thanks for that, must try it. Den.
Keyboards: Yamaha Tyros 4, PSR SX700, PSR S970and StagePa300
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Re: Recording on the T4 - EQ settings and the Master Compre

Postby dentyr » 09 Aug 2020 00:28

Why is the Voice Echo on? I think it is the worst thing that Yamaha has jammed into the kbds. I often struggle to get rid of that silly "BONG Bong bong bong" on some of the voices. Even on some of the On Board voices it is there. In the video it occurs when you sing! Regards, Den.
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Re: Recording on the T4 - EQ settings and the Master Compre

Postby mikeg » 09 Aug 2020 18:54

Hi Den I agree with you the echo effect on this video is not for me. I have a Tyros 2 play and sing live spent a lot of time trying to get a consistant setting for michrophone sound to all my registrations and done it as best as I can I think as the flagship keyboards 1 2 3 4 5 and Genos progress each one has more controls on board. However, I have my registrations on a U S B stick which works on them all including the PSRS keyboards Best Regards mikeG.
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Re: Recording on the T4 - EQ settings and the Master Compre

Postby Hugh-AR » 07 Sep 2020 22:11

I found this video extremely interesting. In the early days of 'Cassette Tape Recorders' I came across a (cheap) recorder that had an 'Automatic Volume Control'. Looked like it was the latest technology, so I bought it. Mistake! It was obviously designed for Board Meetings in Offices. If somebody was close to the recorder and spoke very LOUDLY then it recorded their voice at a 'pre-set' level. If somebody was at the back of the room and spoke quietly, then it brought their voice up to the pre-set level. Great for the Secretary who laterhad totype out the Minutes for the meeting. She could hear everyone who spoke at the same level of volume. But for music? No loud or quiet bits. Everything came out deadpan.

When doing a recording on the Tyros 4 the 'default' setting for the Recording Volume is 90. It's the LOUD bits in the music we have to watch, because if that recording level goes up to over 100 it goes 'into the red' and we get 'clipping'' (ie. the Waveform is 'clipped') and that results in distortion. When I used to do STEREO recordings to tape we always had two Meters to watch, a left Channel and a right Channel and had to be very careful that they didn't go 'into the red'. This would often happen right at the end of a piece, as it is fairly common to finish a piece off 'with a flourish'. We would have to do the recording again and have the Recording Levels a little lower. The optimum for recording was to manage to get the loudest bits somewhere between 90 and 100. Record it to quiet and the whole piece played back too quietly.

In the video he says, "I read a lot of people say they turn the Compressor OFF and have all the EQ Settings FLAT so they can avoid hitting that little red light. That is not how to do it!"

So what does the Compressor do? The Compressor prevents you from having that little red dot lighting up in the recording. It turns the LOUD bits down so they are not as loud; and it brings the quieter sounds up a bit so they're not as quiet. So a bit like my tape recorder with the 'Automatic Volume Control', but a bit more subtle in in it's application. In the video he suggests to use the pre-set one for the TRS-MS04 speakers. This is what I have got mine set at (below).

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Here's another video showing what a Compressor does.

What is Audio Compression? How to Use a Compressor.



EQ Settings. He says, "Don't record as FLAT. Makes it 'muddy'."

He has the following settings for EQ:

    EQ 5 = 9dB, at 8kHz
    EQ 4 = 7dB, at 4kHz
    EQ 3 = 0dB, at 1kHz
    EQ 2 = 0dB, at 250Hertz
    EQ 1 = 8dB, at 1Hertz.

The Q column is what he is referring to as the WIDTH.

Press the STORE 1 button and SAVE that as a SETTING.

Hi says, "Gets rid of a lot of the 'muddiness'. makes it have a good sounding high end, good Stereo imaging, and a real good solid, clean 'punch' to the bass. Don't record FLAT or your recording will sound FLAT." (Not in 'pitch' I might add! Just uninspiring.)

Well, I'm not so sure about all this, so I have left my Tyros 4 on the TRS-MS04 setting.

To get to the Compressor or EQ screens, first press the MIXING CONSOLE button, then scroll across the Tabs at the top until you get to the one you want.

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Then to get the EQ SETTINGS screen he show us in the video you have to press EDIT, on the right.

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TRS-MS04 EQ Setting.

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So not only is our Tyros 4 an 'Arranger Keyboard' for 'arranging' music to play, it is also a Recording Studio!
It's all about the music ♫ ♪ ♫ Organ: Yamaha AR80 & Keyboard: Tyros 4
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Re: Recording on the T4 - EQ settings and the Master Compre

Postby Hugh-AR » 08 Sep 2020 20:46

Another video on Compression, explaining what Compression does. When I left school I wanted to be a recording engineer and record bands and orchestras, but the opportunities to do this in those days were very few and far between.

How To Use A Compressor

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Re: Recording on the T4 - EQ settings and the Master Compre

Postby Hugh-AR » 24 Apr 2021 15:40

Some music teachers say that you should have your EQ on FLAT when recording, so in the end I have got my Eq Setting on FLAT.

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Apart from the 'default' settings, I have created another two called HUGH1 and HUGH.
HUGH1 is set up to what was mentioned in the second YouTube video above.
EQ Settings. "Don't record as FLAT. Makes it 'muddy'."

... and he has the following settings for EQ:

    EQ 5 = 9dB, at 8kHz
    EQ 4 = 7dB, at 4kHz
    EQ 3 = 0dB, at 1kHz
    EQ 2 = 0dB, at 250Hertz
    EQ 1 = 8dB, at 1Hertz.

So putting in the settings above, this is my HUGH1.

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And for HUGH I have set the EQ to produce more volume through my speakers as I found my speaker volume was nowhere near loud enough when set to TRS-MS04.

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Here's a recording I have made on my Tyros 4 so you can check out what these different settings do to a recording.
I have played a couple of notes with an Oboe and the Ethereal Voices STYLE, and each time I have switched the EQ down so what you hear is in the same order as in the listing.

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... and finally:

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Do a right-click to open the audio up in a New Tab
DEMO of a couple of notes played with each of the EQ settings above

This is the WAVEFORM from Audacity of what you are listening to.

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It is very difficult to hear the difference betrween the first five settings, but I reckon the first one (FLAT) is a little more solid than the other four.
When you come to HUGH1 (the setting recommended for recording) there is definitely an increase in volume (as you can see from the vertical black line onwards in the WAVEFORM above) .. but I'm not sure about the quality of the altered levels of the volumes. I prefer my FLAT recording at the beginning.

As for that last one (HUGH). Well yes, it has certainly made everything very much louder for my speakers .. but I wouldn't want it on that when I was recording.
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Re: Recording on the T4 - EQ settings and the Master Compre

Postby mikeg » 24 Apr 2021 18:20

Hi compare with mine Thanks for your Post on E Q Settings I will compare with my Settings Best Regards mikeG.
Keyboard: Tyros 2
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Re: Recording on the T4 - EQ settings and the Master Compre

Postby dentyr » 29 Apr 2021 14:55

More on this subject.

What is the Equalizer and how to set up the Master EQ on a Yamaha keyboard - PSR Tutorial

Keyboards: Yamaha Tyros 4, PSR SX700, PSR S970and StagePa300
I knit dolls and animal toys.
I always try to do things which I can't do in order to learn how to do them. ..
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Re: Recording on the T4 - EQ settings and the Master Compre

Postby Hugh-AR » 29 Apr 2021 18:16

Here's another one (sent to me by Den), with the narration in Italian. If you don't speak Italian, play it anyway and just listen to what happens to the sound of the backing, and how his voice changes as he alters the amount of EQ. You can see where in the frequency range he is changing the EQ from the graph showing top left of the screen. This is what he has put about his video:
Frequency equalization ( EQ) is the method of shaping an audio source through the attenuation or addition of certain frequencies. EQ is the the tool you use to manipulate the frequency content of your mix so that everything is balanced and clear.
All Yamaha arrangers have a Master EQ built in, and with it we work on the entire keyboard sound. In this video, I have shown how EQ parameters affect sound. The video was shot on Genos but the setup process and working principle is the same on all Tyros, PSR S PSR SX models. Depending on the keyboard model, there are 5 and 8 band EQs
.


This reminds me very much of what we used to do with our amplifiers when listening to music in those early days. My first amplifier just played 'as is' with no control over anything (apart from VOLUME). Then I had one with a 'Tone Control'. This basically just cut down those higher frequencies, as being a youngster I had very good hearing, and those higher frequencies sounding through those small speakers of our 'Trannies' made the music sound very 'scratchy' and almost impossible to listen to.

And then (Wow!) I had an amplifier with a 'Bass' control and a 'Treble' control. The Treble control cut down the 'treble', and the Bass boosted the bass, which to me, as a youngster. was what I wanted to hear more of! And then came the 'Graphic Equaliser' which allowed us to control everything, across the board.

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Now I would call this a step too far as by altering all these different sliders you end up listening to music that is nothing like what it sounded like originally. If I adjust these sliders when I am listening then that is one thing. but to alter them for a recording? I think it's best to do a recording from my keyboard with the sounds 'as is', and that is why I have my EQ on FLAT when recording.

I have contacted Andrew Gilbert (Music Teacher, Organist and Computer Specialist .. and a Member of our Forum) about all this, and he says:
I tend not to use compressors. It’s hard to teach non-technical people (99% of most home players, probably) so I don’t even try. I just tell them not to use them. There’s plenty of good (and bad!) advice out there on the net and most of it is of necessity, quite technical!

Hugh
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Re: Recording on the T4 - EQ settings and the Master Compre

Postby mikeg » 29 Apr 2021 18:55

Hi Den and Hugh thanks for your Posts on Recording and EQ Settings Best Regards mikeG.
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